CC Legault Transcript

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (00:00)

Hello CC, welcome to the podcast. How are you doing?

CC Legault (00:04)

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (00:09)

Let's dive right in and tell everybody about your book.

CC Legault (00:14)

Okay, sure. So about a year ago, I published my first novel. It's called Who is Bobby May? And it's a novel about a young woman who's in a car accident, and she wakes up in the hospital, and she realises that she can't remember anything from the last four years of her life, including meeting her husband.

So the book really takes you through those first couple of months as she's trying to rebuild her life, figure out who she is, who she was. And what makes this book different from other amnesia stories is that part of the book is old journal entries that the main character wrote before the accident. So as she's kind of figuring out who she was, so is the reader.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (01:03)

So what do we learn about her, and why did you choose to write about amnesia?

CC Legault (01:12)

The idea came to me when I was in my 20s. I had lived in different places, and I had, you know, when you move around, you meet different people and your life is a bit different. And I was kind of, I had just gone through a breakup, and I was thinking about, okay, like, you know, we learn from our experiences and that kind of thing. And then I just started thinking like, okay, but like, what if I were to forget? Would it change who I am?

And if it would, how would it change who I am? And so it's kind of that thinking about the relationship between ourselves and our memories and the interplay into both of these two things that kind of got me started. But at first, it was actually going to be a brain tumour, and she was going to know ahead of time. So the book was going to be a bit different because it was going to be about, like, what do you choose to remember?

But then, when I did more research into that retrograde amnesia, which is the kind of amnesia where you forget your past, a lot of the case studies were from people who had a traumatic brain injury. So then that's when I kind of flipped it around. said, OK, it's better if it starts with an accident. And now she's forgotten everything from the last four years. And then everything kind of just flowed from there.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (02:39)

So the big question was if you could just forget something that happened, then who would you be? Would you?

CC Legault (02:47)

Yeah, how would that, would it change who you are? Is there a part of us that's always the same? You know? And yeah, I've always been interested in psychology. My background is in psychology. And yeah, and then my grandfather had Alzheimer's, you know, so going through that with him, seeing him change and kind of disappear, but then kind of feel like there was still something that was still him.

That was there. Yeah, so I think it was like a combination of things, but the idea came about 20 years ago when I was in my 20s.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (03:26)

Alzheimer's is an interesting influence because a lot of people know someone who has dementia or Alzheimer's, and even we can get very forgetful at times, or we are also just shaped by what we remember. So, what sort of lesson from the research and in writing the book, what did you conclude about

CC Legault (03:40)

Mm-hmm.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (03:55)

To what extent do our memories shape our personalities? Is that it? Is that the angle on the question of who we are, the personalities?

CC Legault (04:07)

The personalities and, yeah, like how we react to things, how we interpret things that happen to us. And even you touched on an important point too, like even though I don't have Alzheimer's, I don't remember everything from my life. Like there's things I don't remember, I'm sure. Yeah, so my conclusion, and it was kind of interesting because

When I'm writing, like, I do have an outline and I have things that I have planned, but that's not necessarily how things work out. You know, it's kind of fluid and it kind of changes, and I get new ideas, and then I, you know, so the ending of the book was actually not what I had planned, but I felt that it was, it was the only ending for the book. So I don't really want to say too much.

CC Legault (05:05)

But so I guess if you were to ask me, my personal belief is that yes, our memories shape who we are, but there's also something else that is us that is constant. Maybe some people call it the soul. Some people call it something else. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (05:28)

So there is something within us that is beyond the external influences.

And does that manifest in the decisions that we make in the preferences? How does that manifest then?

CC Legault (05:50)

Hmm.

It's really hard to know, like, you know, where is that line? You where is the line between, okay, this happened to me and now I'm reacting this way, you know, and just the whole idea that, you know, I don't believe that everything is... You always have the choice. You always have multiple options.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (06:18)

Okay.

CC Legault (06:21)

This is how I see it. Don't believe that you don't have a choice. You always have a choice. I think it's kind of... Yeah, it's hard for me to describe. I guess it's just the combination of so many things, and so many things are just random. Things happen a certain way, and they're not what you had planned, or they're not even what you could have imagined. But it has an effect on who you are.

And how you react to other things. And even the timing, you could have the same event that would happen, whatever, when you're in your 20s in October, and then the same event could happen to you 10 years later, and you would react in a totally different way. So I think that there's really like a relationship between those two things, and it's hard to really put my finger on which is which, right?

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (07:16)

Well, I think it's really true that some things do happen very randomly, and you know, some things just feel really unpredictable. So it sounds like part of what you're exploring is actually why do things happen? So it's beyond the choices we make, but basically, how do we end up where we are? And I think that's a very philosophical question to ask. And honestly, I don't talk with a lot of fiction writers, but I can see that you're asking the questions that we don't often take the time to ask. And I can tell you, being at this point in life, having ended up in situations that I'm in, I end up wondering, gosh, how did I end up here? So I think a lot of people in say, our mid twenties, mid thirties, maybe a mid different decade, we're wondering what fiction writers, but I can see that you're asking the questions that we don't often take the time to ask. And I can tell you, being at this point in life, having ended up in situations that I'm in, I end up wondering, gosh, how did I end up here?

CC Legault (08:03)

Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (08:12)

What happened, but also then will I, can I, let me know if this is one of the questions you've asked in some form, is the reset button.

CC Legault (08:23)

Yeah, and if and that's kind of the thing that the main character is going through is that she doesn't even remember making those decisions. She's married to this person that she doesn't even remember meeting, and you know she has to figure out, okay, like who was I, who am I, where am I going, is this, does this still work for me? And I think I know for me at 43

Yeah, I mean, it's kind of the way you make these decisions that lead to different things. And then you get to a point where you're like, OK, is this am I just doing what I was doing before because I was doing it before? Is it really because this is what I really want right now and it's really what's best for me? You know, and I think for me, that's why writing was so important was, you know, it was just this other side of me that I had kind of.

Not really ignored, but just I just didn't put the time and the effort into it, you know.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (09:26)

So, are you writing more fiction now than you were previously?

CC Legault (09:31)

Yeah, like I wrote a few things when I was younger. I used to write poetry as a teen, and then it was just kind of journals and just kind of thoughts here and there, but I never produced anything. And then I finally decided I had always dreamed of being a writer, but I'm a teacher during the day, and I have a family, and I'm busy.

And so one day I just decided that's it. If not now, then when? I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna set the time aside. I'm gonna treat it like a part-time job instead of a hobby, and I'm gonna do it. And honestly, it was...

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (10:07)

Exactly.

CC Legault (10:21)

It was good for me in so many ways, like even if even if I hadn't actually published it, just the experience of saying, OK, can I do this? Am I able to write a whole book and then just? Yes, it is. Yeah, it's on.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (10:32)

So the book is out now.

That's such an achievement.

CC Legault (10:40)

Yeah. And honestly, even just having the book out and then all the people that I've met because of the book, that has also been something that has brought a lot to my life too. I've met other writers, I've met readers, I've met podcasters. And, you know, it's just, it's like this whole other side of my life that I wouldn't have explored if I hadn't taken that chance and put the time in, you know.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (11:09)

That's a realisation I can relate to because I was very much staying in my local bubble and creating the podcast, just like how you meet people talking about your book. We're both realising that when you create something that you can share with more people, it actually connects you with more people. So it's making you feel less isolated, and there's a sense of belonging.

CC Legault (11:33)

Yep. And you're connecting with some through something that means something to you, you know, which makes it even more powerful. Right.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (11:46)

It is. And I think one of the questions that has really emerged from your process and your research is we all live longer than we would have a hundred or 200 years ago. And so I think that for a while, a lot of people have been asking, okay, we have potentially, you could live to 90 or a hundred, whatever it might become. And so there's this question of, well, who can I be in all this time and a lot of it I'm wondering if you felt as well as though you have nine lives and it's like you're having another life sometimes and okay what is this you know people call it a chapter or whatever but it's this okay next era what can it be because we have so much choice and freedom

CC Legault (12:16)

Yeah. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah, if you go back 50 years ago, 100 years ago, there just weren't that many options. And even just in the last 20 years with the internet and everything that that has brought, just that makes the world so much bigger, and you have access to just so many people and so many resources. Yeah, it's true.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (13:03)

Definitely. So you're a teacher, were you always a teacher? Did you do something else before you became a teacher?

CC Legault (13:11)

Okay.

So teaching has always been my career. So I started teaching when I was, I think I was 23, so fresh out of university. I did take a year off from teaching to do my master's in human development. I studied the children's understanding of emotions. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (13:38)

Okay, I'd love to ask you about that sometime soon.

CC Legault (13:44)

Yeah, so, my research was actually about children's understanding of hiding emotions. So how do children understand that, you know, sometimes you might feel something, but you might express something else? So, for example, if you got a pair of grey socks for Christmas, you know, and they see this protagonist who is showing

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (13:53)

hiding emotions.

CC Legault (14:13)

They have to decide, okay, which expression would they show and then how would that make the other person feel? And I was trying to see if there was a difference between six-year-olds, it was a long time ago, but I think it was like six-year-olds, and was it six and eight-year-olds? Anyways, there were two groups there, and there actually wasn't a significant relationship in the end, but it was really interesting to study just counterfactual reasoning and how children's cognition develops over time. But yeah, so I'm just a person who loves a challenge. Yeah, so my next challenge was writing a book, and I really enjoyed it.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (14:58)

It sounds like part of what you enjoy is figuring out why we think how we think.

CC Legault (15:04)

Yes, absolutely, I'm always thinking about that.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (15:10)

I should think about thinking more often. You're really inspiring me, and I think we all should. I used the word think a lot, but this is a really fun conversation. So the thing about other people having an emotion that they don't express, I think that adults can learn from that as well as children, especially since so many people are just a bit socially clueless or on the spectrum or just not quite wrapping their heads around it, not quite understanding. And

CC Legault (15:16)

Thanks.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (15:40)

So I'm just curious for a second, sure maybe we can be inspired by the six-year-old, I wish you would have researched more age groups, but I'm wondering were some of those young ones just not realising that people were experiencing something other than what they were showing?

CC Legault (15:43)

Yeah.

Well, there were a few variables that might have changed the results. So the professor who was my, I don't remember what the term is, but the professor who was like guiding me, she had done a similar, she had done a lot of research on children's understanding of emotions. And when she did her research, she did find a significant difference, but she went a little bit younger.

So her younger group was more around five. One thing that we changed with my research was that while the child was listening to the story and then answering the questions, they had access to kind of like a big mat with the characters without a facial expression. And then there were pictures with different facial expressions, and they could, like, take the appropriate expression and put it on the face, which made it a bit more accessible for them. So maybe the fact that we changed that, maybe that's why we didn't see a significant difference, or maybe it's just because the young group was just over that threshold, and they were able to understand that you can feel something and show something different.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (17:20)

Right, right. So getting back to the book and also creativity with, with deciding to write a book, with deciding to write a book, you were able to really empower yourself to get creative. And you told me before you started recording that you were able to make something and work on something without it having to be your full-time job. And that's.

CC Legault (17:48)

Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (17:49)

That's a really crucial lesson. I mean, a lot of people need to learn that now. I'm wondering what inspired you to make that change? Was it something you learned? know some people are teaching that in the self-help world. Did something influence it, or did you just decide now is the time for more?

CC Legault (18:04)

Yeah.

I'm not sure, honestly. I know that, like I said, I had always wanted to write a book. It had always been something that I really, really wanted to do. So it was always kind of in the background, and sometimes I would kind of start writing, but then I would just give up or whatever. I don't, I can't really say that there was something specific that in that moment made me decide.

CC Legault (18:42)

But yeah, I don't really know. I know it was like around New Year's, and I have report cards to write, which are really long. So I decided, okay, I'm gonna give myself some time, and I'm gonna wait a week after I'm done writing the report cards in February. I'm gonna choose a date, then I'm gonna start. Then I actually Googled how many words is a novel? And then I said, ‘Really?’ That's what I did? And then I said, Okay, that's it.

So I need to write about 10,000 words a month, and I'm gonna be done before the next report cards. You know, but I wasn't done before the next report cards, but still it was something that kind of kept me on track without being too like, I don't work well when it's too structured, and I feel like I have to do something. I don't like that, but it was just enough of a structure to kind of like push me to keep going.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (19:40)

…was a guide. I see. And so you had a bit of a goal of a timeline, and that's something we can be inspired by because you weren't saying, okay, I'll just get it done whenever it finishes. So part of what making part of what's making it happen is to actually get it done within a time, but not guilt yourself. I know sometimes we can feel the pressure and maybe just too much guilt when we're feeling rushed. But also, it means you got a better result because you had the forgiveness for yourself and the empowerment to say, okay, this needs a little bit more, but you are still having the discipline. And was there a sense of routine as well in how you were working on it within the time?

CC Legault (20:09)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, so what I did was I worked mostly at night because I have a family, so that was like my quiet time and listening to music really helped me. Like even if even if I was like, I don't feel like writing, then I'd be like okay, but I'm not gonna watch TV or whatever, I'm gonna put on my headphones and I'm gonna listen to music and I'm gonna think about what's going on in my character's life right now. And you know if I write a paragraph, okay and if I write

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (20:48)

Hmm?

CC Legault (21:03)

And then I always kind of tried to think about when I wouldn't be writing, I would be thinking about what's coming up next in the story. You know, even if it's the morning, I'm having my coffee, I don't feel like writing, I'm half asleep. Well, I'm just gonna think about Bobby May and what's happening and what's gonna happen next, and how does Simon feel about this and just kind of playing around in my head. And...

And also another thing that helped was to just focus on getting the story out from beginning to end. You know, not nitpicking everything on the way, just, okay, I need to get this out. Then once it was out, then I could start doing some of my own editing. And then I hired an editor to do the editing. It doesn't have to all be perfect right away. You do it in layers.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (22:00)

In layers.

CC Legault (22:02)

Yep.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (22:04)

So, okay, that's, so what you're saying is that it doesn't have to be perfect immediately.

CC Legault (22:10)

No, no.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (22:13)

So part of what we can do is to just write and see what comes out. Also, another thing you said that's really crucial to the process is that you thought about it throughout the day. You directed your attention to the project, and a lot of manifestation people say that you will get what you bring your attention to.

CC Legault (22:18)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm, which makes total sense, right? If you're not paying attention.

I mean, then you're sitting down at night and you're like, okay, I have to write. What was going on again? know? Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (22:51)

Something like that.

Why was it, why did you choose someone who is married? Why? How did you pick the situation that the character is finding herself in?

CC Legault (23:13)

Well, I wanted her to be in her 20s. In the first book, when I was going to have a brain tumour, she was going to be in her 30s, and she was going to have a child. But then when it became an accident and she wasn't going to write her story first, she was going to discover it later, I wanted her to be in her 20s because I thought, like for myself, in my 20s is when I changed the most as a person. And then in my 30s, it was kind of, I don't know, maybe a bit more routine and not a whole lot changing. So yeah, so that's why I wanted it to be in her 20s, because I wanted her to forget four years or whatever, and I wanted it to have an impact. I wanted her to be married, and I wanted her to not remember being married because...

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (23:42)

How?

CC Legault (24:13)

I just thought, like, I thought about the effect that this kind of trauma would have on the people around her. And I just thought that that would be like, can you imagine? You're married to somebody and they don't even remember who you are at all, you know, and how do you rebuild that? And then, I mean, kind of the question of if there was something really great with this person before, does it automatically mean that it will come back again, or is it dependent on the memories and the things that happen in that period of time? And I also had her. She has a sister who she's really close to because I have two sisters that I'm super close to, and I know that that relationship is really important to me, and it was somebody that she could remember that was still in her life to kind of help her through that period of time.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (24:47)

You

Now, let's see.

CC Legault (25:12)

Yeah, a lot of it kind of unfolded organically. Like, there was some planning involved, and it was a little bit tricky because I had a lot of timelines to work with. Like, there was a timeline of one of the set of journal entries and then another timeline, and that was what was going on in the present, and it all had to kind of line up, which was fun. I had fun writing it. 

I don't remember what I was talking about. I think I went on a tangent.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (25:45)

So part of what you said is that it's all good. Part of what really got my attention in what you said is the question of, she had something great with someone previously. And I'm interpreting from all your speculation, the question of, well, can that happen again? Was it a moment in time? And I think that when anyone is looking at a long-term relationship, we end up wondering, we were fireworks, we maybe just had magic or whatever it might be for a while, but then not only does that change far beyond the honeymoon period of obviously, and we all have heard about that, but also being with someone for long time, the life circumstances change. And I know that I think the comparison that I can make

CC Legault (26:38)

Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (26:43)

For you, a lot of people could relate to is that the pandemic, for example, changed so many relationships. A lot of people had breakups. And I think that we all changed. A lot of the speculation says that our brains changed after being in isolation, after all the panic we're going through, basically a collective trauma. So it could be that, or sometimes we have psychological traumas or anything like that, even if it's not full amnesia and then something is rewired and you're just not who you were. I mean, I know that I wasn't the person I was a decade ago. It's just not. And you're probably not the person you were a decade ago. So then, if you're trying to relate to people, you're wondering, can I still create the value that people need?

CC Legault (27:19)

Yeah.

Yeah.

No.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (27:39)

With the new person that as the new person that I am now.

CC Legault (27:40)

Yeah,

yeah exactly.

Yeah, and I mean, yeah, I feel for my characters. It's like that must be really hard. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (27:48)

Yes.

Okay, here's a question.

Do you look forward to you feel inspired by your own story you created and others in wondering, where are you going to be 10 or 20 years from now? And do you ever just let go of that and be mindful and say anything could happen next?

CC Legault (28:15)

So for my characters, I'm actually writing the sequel right now. Yeah. Yes, because I wasn't sure when I started writing the novel. I didn't know if I would write like other books following that first one. I just kind of went with it, and then I got to the end, and I was like, okay, you know, there's more. And so my first novel is really is a lot more like character-driven and then the sequel is going to be more plot-driven. So there's more things that are going to happen on the outside that are going to ⁓ have an impact on in Bobby May's life. So I wasn't ready to let her go. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (29:02)

You weren't ready. Are you feeling a bit attached to this character now?

CC Legault (29:09)

In some ways, in some ways, yeah. Yeah, it's a strange experience, really. And to have like, I've had readers contact me and you know, they've really connected with this character, and you know, they've thanked me for, you know, thank you for giving me Bobby May, and it's like, like I created something that I created with my imagination and then it meant something to somebody else who I've never met. Like that's pretty cool, right?

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (29:41)

It really is. Did they tell you what they got from the story?

CC Legault (29:48)

⁓

Like I'm trying to think that.

I mean, part of it is some people have come to me because they've had traumatic brain injuries or they've known somebody close to them who's had that experience. And honestly, I would say on a typical day, if I go sell my book at the market or something, you know, I might sell, let's say, I would say, if I were to give you a percentage of how many people.

I don't know, maybe one person or two people out of 20 will come and see me and say that they've actually had the experience, or they know somebody who's had the experience. So it's a lot more than I thought.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (30:30)

It's that often.

I'm surprised by that. So it's actually a common thing to happen.

CC Legault (30:38)

Relatively, yet where people will forget, usually it's an accident, and they forget a part of their memories, yeah

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (30:50)

What have they told you about how they navigate life and all that?

CC Legault (30:57)

Well, one thing that comes up is, you know, they'll talk about how their loved ones were important in telling them things about themselves. That it's strange, like, to have other people know things about you that you don't know about yourself. ⁓

Yeah, I mean, I think that's, and it's something that comes up in the book as well. So, yeah, it's, it's, yeah, and some people have had other things too because of the accident. Maybe they have mobility issues, or they have, now my character doesn't have that. It's really just memory-related, but there are also people who have gone through something similar, and they have all these other things that they need to cope with as well. So, yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (31:53)

So people are ending up with extra needs, and when it's an accident, did they sometimes have a normal life? And I shouldn't use the word normal, but they could have had a very mainstream life with access to what everybody would have access to and the ability to do anything. And then they just don't. So I'm guessing part of what they adjusting to, that'd be adjusting to the learning curve and the surprise of a whole different existence.

CC Legault (32:26)

And the effect that it has on how you perceive yourself, which is really what Bobby May is going through, is that this happens out of the blue, and then all of a sudden it changes your relationship to yourself, and you know, how do you rebuild? How do you reconnect with yourself, with the people around you? How do you see yourself? So it's really a book about identity, connection, family, and also just, I mean, you have to appreciate the life you have. You really, we never know what's going to happen, right? And yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (33:11)

That's true. So you're saying that we can have an amazing life, and our ideal, and anything can happen next.

So don't just live in the moment, but have gratitude for it.

CC Legault (33:26)

Yeah. Exactly, yes. Yeah, yeah, because you never know. You never know what's going on. Something positive can happen, or there could be a loss. There could be something that, you know, affects your life in a negative way. But you really, you never know. So it's just as you say, you have to be grateful and do your best and don't waste your time. Do things that you really enjoy and that make you feel alive, and yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (34:00)

There's a point, live life while you can. Are you feeling inspired and motivated to get out there and try new things? That's actually, I remember now you emphasised that a lesson before we started recording that people need to do something, make something, try anything. And it sounds like it's not just trying to justify creativity or passion beyond our day jobs, but it's also, it's also trying to make the most of the time we have on this planet. And basically living a purpose-driven life.

CC Legault (34:36)

Yeah.

Yes and I mean it doesn't have to be really it could be crocheting if you like crocheting you like to listen to music you know do something that makes you feel I think most people can relate to that something that makes you feel like yourself makes you feel alive makes you feel like you have energy and you want to do things and you want to try things and you know even if

Even if you can't rationally explain to yourself why you should be spending time doing that instead of doing the laundry or, you know, doing things that need to be done, you know.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (35:21)

Right, right. So, you're saying that we can branch away from the very utilitarian goals of just ‘make more money’ and ‘do more laundry’ or anything practical. it's basically justifying creativity.

CC Legault (35:33)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (35:42)

So I think this is really encouraging because I want to delve deeper. So in promoting your book, that's actually something we can explore. And I know an author who is trying to promote a book. That does come up. And I think that, be honest with you, I started writing a book a few years ago, and then I just thought there's more life to live, but...

I'm really curious, we can all write a book if we really sit down and do it, but then promoting it, what has it been like trying to promote the book?

CC Legault (36:18)

That has been the hardest part for me.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (36:21)

Bye.

CC Legault (36:24)

Many reasons. I think part of it is I want to be writing. I want to be writing my other book. I don't want to be promoting. Also, I think I just don't have a background. It's something I know very little about. And also, there's kind of this fear that I don't want to sound salesy. I don't want to sound like I'm trying to sell my book, and to me, that seems fake. And I'm somebody who likes… I like having a conversation with somebody. I like things that feel authentic. But I'm actually slowly, like, I'm starting to see how I can connect with future readers or just with other people in a way that does feel organic and feels authentic to me. So like, for example, especially threads, I've been on there maybe just a month or something, maybe two months.

And I love it because I feel like I don't have to do like a big post with like, you know, something fancy. I can just say what I want and respond to other people. And to me, that feels more natural than something that looks really nice and that I've spent a lot of time putting together and then nobody sees it.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (37:49)

Interesting. In Australia, we have a phrase called the tall poppy syndrome. And, okay, so if I needed to explain that, my understanding is that back in the war times, the teaching was if you grow too tall, then a poppy could get chopped. So don't grow too tall. And that's a big thing in Australia of don't be too...

CC Legault (37:56)

Okay.

Okay. Okay.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (38:18)

Too much, too much of you. And I love the old lesson that Oprah has often said about why being full of yourself is a bad thing. Because who else would you be full of? I wanted to really encourage you. You can, you can be the best version of yourself and present the best version of yourself without, I know on my end,

CC Legault (38:31)

Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (38:47)

I don't wear makeup these days. think I last wore makeup two or three years ago. And so we can sort of get out there and get connected and see audiences and to do things without. I can't even remember how long it has been since I wore heels. So things like that. You can relate. I think, but we can still get out there. 

CC Legault (39:04)

I have trouble with heels, too.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (39:16)

But do you think that part of it is having to talk yourself up?

CC Legault (39:24)

Yeah, maybe in some ways. ⁓

Yeah, I just, more of a listener too, like in real life, if you saw me, like in the staff room, I'm somebody who does more listening than talking. So I'm not somebody who likes to be the centre of attention. So I guess maybe that's part of it too. But I think for me, it just has to feel like it's a real reflection of who I am in real life, you know, and I'm not pretending to be somebody I'm not.

CC Legault (39:58)

But I think I'm slowly getting there. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (40:03)

Yes. There's, I believe there's an in-between where we don't have to turn into a whole different person, but we can still get out there a bit. But I think that you're doing really well, of course, I to acknowledge that you're putting yourself out there being on a podcast and selling your book. And I want to really encourage people to read your book, not simply to encourage you, but because

I think that this story is relevant to so many people and I'll send you a link later, but you can see on my podcast, someone talked about it was KJ. I won't try to say her last name either. get a few interesting last names, talking about PR and how where not it's not about the ego. It's that.

CC Legault (40:47)

Okay.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (40:58)

We are being of service in helping people to become aware of how we can help them.

CC Legault (41:04)

Yeah, yeah, exactly, and it's not that I want to sell my book to someone who wouldn't enjoy it. I want, I just want the people who would enjoy it to know that it exists, you know, and read it. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (41:21)

Definitely. You need to find your people, not all people. And frankly, it wouldn't be as fun to reach everybody because some of the great sleep mass marketed brands are just a bit, sometimes that just becomes generic, and there are some global names that do great things, but you're not going to please everybody. Even some of the most famous good-intentioned people out there will still have

CC Legault (41:26)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (41:51)

There'll still be some people following them who just aren't that keen, so you're not going to win over everybody, but that's not the point. Do you think life is not a popularity contest?

CC Legault (41:55)

Yeah. No. No.

No. No. And I think if your goal is to be popular, then you're probably selling out on something, right? Because your goal isn't to be yourself. Your goal is the reaction that you might get from somebody else or how other people will perceive you. And I think that's...

That kind of pulls you away from who you really are, or it could, anyway. Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (42:35)

Definitely. So what would you say to people who are considering writing a book and have not started at all? What's the first step and the next few steps?

CC Legault (42:51)

I think the first step is to be honest with yourself and to ask yourself, Okay, is this really important to me? And if it is, then you have to do it. You have to make the time, or you might regret it. Okay, today I'm feeling great. There's no problem. But what if next week you're in a car accident, or maybe what if something happens and you won't be able to do what you want to do. And I think, I think I would start also by, so once you decide that, is this something I really want? Then you need to have something to kind of keep you on track, and you need to be realistic, right? If I would have said, okay, that's it. I'm starting today. I'm writing my book, you know, well then I wouldn't have been setting myself up to be successful. Instead, I said, No, okay, I'm gonna wait. I'm gonna wait a month. I know I have those report cards to do, and it's gonna be too much. So you need realistic goals that really give you a chance to breathe and not feel so pressured. And I think just don't expect it to be perfect. Take it in steps, write the thing, then go back, learn about it, read other books, you know, connect with other authors or other people who are writing. There's a lot of people out there who are writing and, but I think the biggest thing really is to be honest with yourself. If it's something you really want to do, then I mean you really should do it, you know? Yeah.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (44:41)

If you want to do something meaningful, purposeful, and beneficial, then do it. That's a good lesson. Cece, thank you so much for taking the time to talk about life.

CC Legault (44:56)

Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (44:58)

Anytime. So, by the way, where can people find your book?

CC Legault (45:03)

So my book is for sale on Amazon, and at the moment, it's in KU unlimited, so if you're enrolled, you can read it for free, and I'm available if you want to connect with me. I'm on Facebook and Instagram threads, and I love to hear from readers. I also have a website, CC, so you can reach me there, and there's some links to podcasts and other things I've done

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (45:09)

Thank you.

CC Legault (45:31)

And I genuinely enjoy hearing from readers. So if you want to reach out, it'll make my day.

Melanie Suzanne Wilson (45:39)

Awesome. So get the book, read it and reach out to CC. Okay, CC, thanks so much. Have a wonderful rest of the day.

CC Legault (45:47)

Thank you, you too.